From: fractint-owner@xmission.com (fractint Digest) To: fractint-digest@xmission.com Subject: fractint Digest V1 #5 Reply-To: fractint@xmission.com Sender: fractint-owner@xmission.com Errors-To: fractint-owner@xmission.com Precedence: fractint Digest Wednesday, August 20 1997 Volume 01 : Number 005 In this issue: (fractint) Fractint File formats Re: (fractint) question for developers (fractint) Short absence Re: (fractint) Truecolor question (fractint) Re: Fractint tutorials (fractint) finally got around to saving some par files :^) Re: (fractint) finally got around to saving some par files :^) Re: (fractint) finally got around to saving some par files :^) (fractint) Re: (fractint) Tru.c workings (fractint) Fractint GIF format (binary) (fractint) GIF file format site Re: (fractint) good general book? (fractint) Hello (fractint) Hello again (fractint) Question Re: (fractint) Question Re: (fractint) Question (fractint) Question Re: (fractint) Question Re: (fractint) Question Re: (fractint) Question (fractint) Hello Re: (fractint) Question Re: (fractint) Question See the end of the digest for information on subscribing to the fractint or fractint-digest mailing lists and on how to retrieve back issues. ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: Fri, 15 Aug 1997 18:54:13 -0600 From: "Tim Wegner" Subject: (fractint) Fractint File formats Rich, Re different Fractint formats for IFS, Lsystems, PAR The reason for the split is that the original IFS and Lsystem files came first, amd the parameter idea came later. Feel free to propose a syntax for embedding Lsystems and IFS into PAR files. But you'll have to make a case for it, and show that there's an advaqntage. The current lsystems and IFS formats make interoperability easy with other programs. For example, fdesign can read and write Fractint IFS files. The lsystem format is pretty standard, we've just wrapped curly brackets around it. Tim - ------------------------------------------------------------ Thanks for using Fractint, The Fractals and Fractint Discussion List Post Message: fractint@xmission.com Get Commands: majordomo@xmission.com "help" Administrator: twegner@phoenix.net Unsubscribe: majordomo@xmission.com "unsubscribe fractint" ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 15 Aug 1997 18:54:13 -0600 From: "Tim Wegner" Subject: Re: (fractint) question for developers Noel mused: > I have some concern for existing features like colour cycling > and palette editing, if true-colour displays are adopted. Color cycling is a hardware feature of super VGA boards in 256-color modes. It necessarily won't work in truecolor. When Fractint adds truecolor capabilities, color cycling will still work in 256 color modes. > Won't Fractint > have to switch graphics modes to utilize both truecolour and palette > editing? Not necessarily. One of the first truecolor algorithms we implement will be one that continuously interpolates colors between the escape-time bands. A 256-color palette editor will still be useful for designing the colors of such an image. But basically you are right. Truecolor demands a whole different approach to coloring fractals. If truecolor is calculated "on the fly" you won't be able to recolor fractals as a post-process, at least not in the same way. On the other hand, Fractint could simultaneously store the iteration and orbit information in a file, and special post-processing could construct colors using different algorithms, includoing use of a super-long palette. > Isn't this rather a problem in the windows 3.1 and win95 > environment. You won't be able to color cycle if Windows is in a truecolor mode. Bert Tyler did get color cycling to work with the now-very-old Winfract port, but under a 256-color video mode. > Does this mean that Fractint will > primarily remain a dos program or at least non-windows? It means that if you want color cycling, you will have to use a 256-color video driver for windows. In the long run, my opinion is that color cycling will be less and less important as truecolor hardware and software become dominant. Fractint can't stay as a DOS program and progress. At the very least, fractint needs porting to a DOS extender environment such as the djgpp compiler. Tim - ------------------------------------------------------------ Thanks for using Fractint, The Fractals and Fractint Discussion List Post Message: fractint@xmission.com Get Commands: majordomo@xmission.com "help" Administrator: twegner@phoenix.net Unsubscribe: majordomo@xmission.com "unsubscribe fractint" ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 15 Aug 1997 18:54:13 -0600 From: "Tim Wegner" Subject: (fractint) Short absence I'll be gone from Saturday morning (August 16) through Wednesday (August 20). List traffic can continue as normal, but I won't be available to handle any special fractint list problems until I get back. Tim Fractint list owner - ------------------------------------------------------------ Thanks for using Fractint, The Fractals and Fractint Discussion List Post Message: fractint@xmission.com Get Commands: majordomo@xmission.com "help" Administrator: twegner@phoenix.net Unsubscribe: majordomo@xmission.com "unsubscribe fractint" ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 15 Aug 1997 18:54:13 -0600 From: "Tim Wegner" Subject: Re: (fractint) Truecolor question Jason, > I'm trying to decipher just what's going on in that little bonus program > called TRU.C which comes with Fractint. I don't have time to answer this now, as I'm leaving for a few days on a trip. I would like to say I'd love to see people play with tru.c, because we're ovrdue for a truecolor implementation push. If no one else can answer, please remind me after I get back next Thursday. Tim - ------------------------------------------------------------ Thanks for using Fractint, The Fractals and Fractint Discussion List Post Message: fractint@xmission.com Get Commands: majordomo@xmission.com "help" Administrator: twegner@phoenix.net Unsubscribe: majordomo@xmission.com "unsubscribe fractint" ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 16 Aug 1997 13:16:43 -0400 From: Les St Clair Subject: (fractint) Re: Fractint tutorials Hi Peter, >>I've been playing with Fractint for a while now, having a lot of fun with it, but I feel as if I don't understand what I'm doing very deeply. = I know the book that originally was written to accompany the program is lon= g gone out of print because I've been searching for it. Is there a good general tutorial on the program out there?<< Don't forget the excellent documentation that comes with the latest relea= se (v19.6) of Fractint. To get the full, 200+ page, Fractint.doc you need to execute the command Once you have expanded this documet you will find most of what you need = to know on how to use the program, as well as detailed explanation of all th= e fractal types supported plus history and background on fractals in genera= l! (page 138, I think). Bradley Beacham's "Formula Parser Tutorial" is now also included with Fractint (you'll need to unzip it). Primarily designed to introduce user= s to the wonders of formula writing, it also contains an introduction to complex numbers plus a walkthrough of how the mandelbrot set is generated= =2E [apologies, of course, if you already knew this!] - - Les - ------------------------------------------------------------ Thanks for using Fractint, The Fractals and Fractint Discussion List Post Message: fractint@xmission.com Get Commands: majordomo@xmission.com "help" Administrator: twegner@phoenix.net Unsubscribe: majordomo@xmission.com "unsubscribe fractint" ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 16 Aug 1997 20:07:10 -0400 (EDT) From: "Melissa D. Binde" Subject: (fractint) finally got around to saving some par files :^) These are all fractals I've created in the last month or so. Unfortunately they're not available online yet, but I'll have them up by the middle of September. Until then, here are a few. They are all fractals which I've put into my "odd fractals" category. Eaves { ; Melissa Binde (binde@terindell.com) reset=1960 type=fn+fn function=tan/asin center-mag=-0.042885/-0.0626068/0.00999991/0.6001 params=3/0/-1/2 bailoutest=imag inside=startrail colors=000PXQ<3>6Q6b`b<13>QMEbbc<15>rxXWVc<3>22g`Xg<3>S9wbaa<14>Rl0b`b<1\ 5>j7Nbab<17>se6`_b<15>21Ibab<21>duHa`c<17>I6kmLSx4FbZb<4>bGUbCSdYa<5>v4O\ b`c<21>t6scbe<5>jjvbac<18>QRpmmZyyUfLhj3mbac<17>tdWaW_<6>dM_ } Modern Art I { ; Melissa Binde (binde@terindell.com) reset=1960 type=fn*z+z function=recip center-mag=-0.133608/-0.30777/0.07022472 params=1/0/1/0 maxiter=10000 outside=imag colors=000000<30>zKU<30>211000000<14>000010030<29>0z0<30>020000000<14>00\ 0110330<29>zz0<30>220000000<29>000 } Modern Art II { ; Melissa Binde (binde@terindell.com) reset=1960 type=mandel(fn||fn) function=abs/floor center-mag=+0.06542968500000002/+0.00207519499999997/0.3335641/0.9996 params=0/0/0.5 maxiter=1000 outside=atan colors=000VHWC9hdaP<3>pt`dUXfQghLsZuubPKbGIa6GZUJ<4>D72UcR<2>2uhQ_LDaKZU\ J<4>CA4ZYM<6>1bGa_K<4>XjA`UL<6>G1DcXQ<6>pPwWWI<3>1M0dZT<2>lcmYYT<2>I`pGB\ qaYK<4>WWANPU7Gb_YR<4>GbpgPSmGZY_M<5>0lH_WQ<5>FFpZXQ<5>6PqttGeVL<2>nLHcW\ M<6>mIJZUJVQGRLDcVL<6>n3CcRW<2>f6zUVL<2>0MHRPOFFQ35SZXM<4>AQJXdaRkq_ZI<3\ >Le0bZJ<5>ge1cYVdZce_lb`N<6>_wWXbM<3>7yMaZV<2>ZbvbRUcJbdBklSPvMSXYM<3>8a\ NfSM<3>z3IcUR<5>i0wZ`O<3>HpZRYCEY1SdZGkk4rx_PJXGGT7DeYR<4>u`qYZP<5>0gkZ`\ L<3>InFebK<3>txCWODOD35GZ<5>OlB } Attraction { ; Melissa Binde (binde@terindell.com) reset=1960 type=fn*z+z function=sin center-mag=10.2981/0.103254/21.26705 params=1/0/1/0 maxiter=10000 inside=startrail colors=0007D7<2>EQF0AK<2>1Qooyz202<18>f5q120<17>Ro6124<7>FIf121<16>KmP64\ 4<8>xlc111<21>Rde888<3>cdc111<22>RRP443<11>sqiIM2_g5215<8>KHm211<22>yUR1\ 33<5>7RQ033<14>8nm133<15>TpoBIEM_TYrg022<21>Gwu242919485 } Untitled I { ; Melissa Binde (binde@terindell.com) reset=1960 type=barnsleyj1 center-mag=-7.81415e-005/2.831e-006/2.722332 params=-0.02250748872756958/1.029216051101685 bailoutest=manr colors=00000U60Z<56>wzzF9g<98>00AO9n<46>mJnM8n<34>J8fM8nJ8f<9>I7d } Pierce { ; Melissa Binde (binde@terindell.com) reset=1960 type=manfn+zsqrd function=exp center-mag=-1.01564455569461800/-0.00000000000000078/2.73224 params=0/0 float=y maxiter=5000 bailoutest=imag outside=atan colors=000OQ_<52>wwwILY<64>OJzJKY<7>S5QILY<47>TCqILY<56>bbeILY<5>IMWIMWI\ LYIMW<8>JNT } Sunset I { ; Melissa Binde (binde@terindell.com) reset=1960 type=manzzpwr center-mag=-0.09039579154635699/-0.00119081522699212/17.72227 params=0/0/1.98 float=y maxiter=5000 bailoutest=imag outside=mult colors=000NAA<8>GEJFFKGFJ<3>LEFMEEODDPCC<22>x11z00z10<29>zx0zz0zz1<29>zz\ xzzzzzz<61>zV1zU0zU0zT0<28>z10z00z00y00<30>c00b11a11`22_22<14>OAA } Sunset II { ; Melissa Binde (binde@terindell.com) reset=1960 type=mandel(fn||fn) function=sin/ident center-mag=+0.05046081500000010/+0.00207519499999997/0.3335641/0.9996 params=0/0/0.5 outside=imag colors=00K00K00PGWBNfPnoUnUUncKncUccUccAcUAUK0X5ZX5aX5dY6g<6>U1tT1vT2v<6\ >WAywnQT9v<3>TDswnQTFr<3>TKpwnQTMo<4>USmwnQUUl<5>U`iwmA<35>xr6xs6xs5xt5x\ t5<10>zz0zz0zz0zz0zz0<27>zz0bPb<8>UobNzc<9>Uqb`_B<36>Uqbwcp<27>Vqbk8f<7>\ WlbEUv<2>Qkgu7_<9>hTa } - -- Melissa Binde -- binde@cs.swarthmore.edu Outside the Asylum -- http://www.terindell.com/ Babylon 5 Weekly Column -- http://babylon5.miningco.com - ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ It was a high counsel that I once heard given to a young person, "Always do what you are afraid to do." -- Ralph Waldo Emerson - ------------------------------------------------------------ Thanks for using Fractint, The Fractals and Fractint Discussion List Post Message: fractint@xmission.com Get Commands: majordomo@xmission.com "help" Administrator: twegner@phoenix.net Unsubscribe: majordomo@xmission.com "unsubscribe fractint" ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 17 Aug 1997 20:12:10 -0400 From: franz@mediom.qc.ca (Francois Blais) Subject: Re: (fractint) finally got around to saving some par files :^) "Melissa D. Binde" wrote: >Modern Art II { ; Melissa Binde (binde@terindell.com) > reset=1960 type=mandel(fn||fn) function=abs/floor > center-mag=+0.06542968500000002/+0.00207519499999997/0.3335641/0.9996 > params=0/0/0.5 maxiter=1000 outside=atan > colors=000VHWC9hdaP<3>pt`dUXfQghLsZuubPKbGIa6GZUJ<4>D72UcR<2>2uhQ_LDaKZU\ > J<4>CA4ZYM<6>1bGa_K<4>XjA`UL<6>G1DcXQ<6>pPwWWI<3>1M0dZT<2>lcmYYT<2>I`pGB\ > qaYK<4>WWANPU7Gb_YR<4>GbpgPSmGZY_M<5>0lH_WQ<5>FFpZXQ<5>6PqttGeVL<2>nLHcW\ > M<6>mIJZUJVQGRLDcVL<6>n3CcRW<2>f6zUVL<2>0MHRPOFFQ35SZXM<4>AQJXdaRkq_ZI<3\ > >Le0bZJ<5>ge1cYVdZce_lb`N<6>_wWXbM<3>7yMaZV<2>ZbvbRUcJbdBklSPvMSXYM<3>8a\ > NfSM<3>z3IcUR<5>i0wZ`O<3>HpZRYCEY1SdZGkk4rx_PJXGGT7DeYR<4>u`qYZP<5>0gkZ`\ > L<3>InFebK<3>txCWODOD35GZ<5>OlB > } I find this one very interesting. In particular the fact that it's based on a Fractint 'bug'. If you set floating point to yes, you'll see the difference. I also found another interesting variation with both fp enabled and the outside color set to atan. Thanks for the par! - -- La voix de ma contrebasse Quebec City * Canada "Research is what I'm doing when I don't know what I'm doing." - ------------------------------------------------------------ Thanks for using Fractint, The Fractals and Fractint Discussion List Post Message: fractint@xmission.com Get Commands: majordomo@xmission.com "help" Administrator: twegner@phoenix.net Unsubscribe: majordomo@xmission.com "unsubscribe fractint" ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 17 Aug 1997 22:30:58 -0400 (EDT) From: "Melissa D. Binde" Subject: Re: (fractint) finally got around to saving some par files :^) On Sun, 17 Aug 1997, Francois Blais wrote: > "Melissa D. Binde" wrote: > > >Modern Art II { ; Melissa Binde (binde@terindell.com) > > I find this one very interesting. > In particular the fact that it's based on a Fractint 'bug'. > If you set floating point to yes, you'll see the difference. > I also found another interesting variation with both fp enabled and > the outside color set to atan. > Thanks for the par! Yes, lots of them have "cousins" which I have squirreled away on my hard drive :^). I liked this version best though. - -- Melissa Binde -- binde@cs.swarthmore.edu Outside the Asylum -- http://www.terindell.com/ Babylon 5 Weekly Column -- http://babylon5.miningco.com - ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ The system runs with NT 3.51, service pack 5. At now, we have no idea why. -- out of context; from a mailing list - ------------------------------------------------------------ Thanks for using Fractint, The Fractals and Fractint Discussion List Post Message: fractint@xmission.com Get Commands: majordomo@xmission.com "help" Administrator: twegner@phoenix.net Unsubscribe: majordomo@xmission.com "unsubscribe fractint" ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 18 Aug 1997 11:19:37 -0700 From: Kenny McAlpine Subject: (fractint) Re: > What is a good general book on fractals, something somehere between pop > science and a rigorous mathematical treatment? > A good one is Peitgen, Jurgens and Saupe's 'Fractals for the Classroom' parts 1 & 2, pub. Springer-Verlag. It's aimed at American Schoolkids, and can be approached either as a rigorous treatment, or as a nice easy introduction. Highly recommended. Kenny - ------------------------------------------------------------ Thanks for using Fractint, The Fractals and Fractint Discussion List Post Message: fractint@xmission.com Get Commands: majordomo@xmission.com "help" Administrator: twegner@phoenix.net Unsubscribe: majordomo@xmission.com "unsubscribe fractint" ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 18 Aug 1997 08:20:48 -0600 (MDT) From: Jason Hine Subject: (fractint) Tru.c workings Howdy all, After a weekend of playing around with the little piece of C code that comes with Fractint called TRU.C, I've determined the following (maybe!): 1) TRU.C is designed to read in the file ITERATES.TGA produced when Fractint is given the "truecolor=yes" command; TRU.C first reads in the file header (see next note!), then reads in the actual iterations data. There is a subroutine, RGBMAP, which produces a new .TGA file containing color data instead of iterations data. 2) There seems to be a problem reading in the header which looks like this: Who-knows-what... 12 bytes xdots............ 2 bytes ydots............ 2 bytes Who-knows-what... 2 bytes Max_iteration.... 4 bytes All these values are being read correctly except for ydots, which always ends up being a large number, like 6147489 or such... 3) If you set a viewwindow size of 50x38 and create iterates.tga, then not only is the ydots in the header corrupt, but the actual iteration data is also incorrect. Can someone provide me with the supposed binary file format for the iterates.tga file? Other suggestions welcome... I have another question, but I'll post it in a separate email. Thanks, all! Jason (Iteration) Hine - ------------------------------------------------------------ Thanks for using Fractint, The Fractals and Fractint Discussion List Post Message: fractint@xmission.com Get Commands: majordomo@xmission.com "help" Administrator: twegner@phoenix.net Unsubscribe: majordomo@xmission.com "unsubscribe fractint" ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 18 Aug 1997 08:33:40 -0600 (MDT) From: Jason Hine Subject: (fractint) Fractint GIF format (binary) Howdy again, As some of you may recall, I'm working on an add-on for Fractint that will allow unmanned zooming... my apologies, please! I mean _unpersoned_ zooming... There is a program out there called Fractal eXtreme which has such a feature, and that program is available for a free trial period (anyone have a URL for that site?) Anyway, I'm debating whether to write my program to work with GIF files or the .TGA file created when you give Fractint the "truecolor=yes" command. The .TGA file would be the easiest to work with, since what I'm really interested in is the iterations value for each pixel, and that's exactly what's in ITERATES.TGA. On the other hand, it seems that the state of Fractint's truecolor support scene is, if not currently, then soon to be undergoing some modifications, whereas the GIF file format seems pretty well established. Also, there may be some problems with Fractint's ability to write ITERATES.TGA for viewwindowed images. Going with the GIF file, on the other hand, would be a pain... mostly because a) there's the LZW compression to deal with, and b) I'm just a novice programmer, and not even any kind of /graphics/ programmer! Choosing to work with GIFs will complicate things programming-wise, but is more likely to mean that my program will still work fine with future versions of Fractint. I'm hoping that Tim will be able to help me come to a decision when he returns... in the meantime, any ideas from the peanut gallery would be most welcome! Jason (the Peanut) Hine - ------------------------------------------------------------ Thanks for using Fractint, The Fractals and Fractint Discussion List Post Message: fractint@xmission.com Get Commands: majordomo@xmission.com "help" Administrator: twegner@phoenix.net Unsubscribe: majordomo@xmission.com "unsubscribe fractint" ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 18 Aug 1997 09:35:36 -0600 (MDT) From: Jason Hine Subject: (fractint) GIF file format site All, I've located a source for GIF and other file format definitons: http://wwwhost.ots.utexas.edu/mac/pub-mac-graphics.html Jason (FYI) Hine - ------------------------------------------------------------ Thanks for using Fractint, The Fractals and Fractint Discussion List Post Message: fractint@xmission.com Get Commands: majordomo@xmission.com "help" Administrator: twegner@phoenix.net Unsubscribe: majordomo@xmission.com "unsubscribe fractint" ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 18 Aug 1997 13:18:33 -0700 From: "Jay Hill" Subject: Re: (fractint) good general book? pfj wrote: Hi. I've been playing with Fractint for a while now, having a lot of fun with it, but I feel as if I don't understand what I'm doing very deeply. I know the book that originally was written to accompany the program is long gone out of print because I've been searching for it. Is there a good general tutorial on the program out there? And what is a good general book on fractals, something somehere between pop science and a rigorous mathematical treatment? Now some have said the Fractint books are out of print. Does anyone out there (I hate it when they say that, like you all are homeless in the cold) want a copy? These show up at close out stores sometimes. A friend of mine saw some, so I'm a huntin'. Let me know if you are interested. Jay http://www.geocities.com/CapeCanaveral/Lab/3825 main(){int f,g,h=0;float a,b,c,d,e;for(;h<3920;putchar("^^/-,;<:lnb/bh`\ r/ylqbAmmhI/S/x`K\013"[++h>3840&&g<25?31-g:g>79?31:f]^^1))if(!(f=(8*(c=( d=(g=1+h%80)/31.-2)*d+(e=.047*(h/80-24))*e)-3)*c+d<3/32.?24:16*(1+2*d+c )<1?30:0))for(a=d,b=c=0;(b=2*b*c+e)*b+(c=a)*a<=4&&++f<26;a=d-b*b+c*c);} - ------------------------------------------------------------ Thanks for using Fractint, The Fractals and Fractint Discussion List Post Message: fractint@xmission.com Get Commands: majordomo@xmission.com "help" Administrator: twegner@phoenix.net Unsubscribe: majordomo@xmission.com "unsubscribe fractint" ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 19 Aug 1997 15:17:33 -0400 From: "Damien M. Jones" Subject: (fractint) Hello Howdy folks... Finally found my way over to this list, now that I got xmission.com to lift the ban on address at emi.net. But it doesn't seem to be generating any mail. Hmmm. Anyway, looking forward to FractInt-specific discussions. Has anyone figured out how to get FractInt to use new coloring techniques, without resorting to changing the source code? Damien M. Jones / temporary sanity designs / http://www.emi.net/~dmj/ dmj@emi.net / my gallery: http://www.geocities.com/SoHo/Lofts/2605/ - ------------------------------------------------------------ Thanks for using Fractint, The Fractals and Fractint Discussion List Post Message: fractint@xmission.com Get Commands: majordomo@xmission.com "help" Administrator: twegner@phoenix.net Unsubscribe: majordomo@xmission.com "unsubscribe fractint" ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 19 Aug 1997 17:40:56 -0400 From: "Damien M. Jones" Subject: (fractint) Hello again Hello... After downloading the archive of previous messages (200K!) I see that people have been introducing themselves a bit as they join. So perhaps I should do that... My first introduction to fractals was in junior high school, in the mid-80s. (Yes, that *does* indicate I'm still a young whipper-snapper. Age is the gift that everyone eventually gets.) I was hooked right away, but it was a few years before I could start messing around on my own, with an Atari ST computer. Three or so years ago I found FractInt (DOS), and my skill with this program continues to improve. (Not necessarily my artistic ability--just my skill with the program. :) Recently I took over management of the Infinite Fractal Loop, a web ring dedicated to fractal art. Its home page is http://www.emi.net/~dmj/ifl/ for those who wish to browse through it. Damien M. Jones / temporary sanity designs / http://www.emi.net/~dmj/ dmj@emi.net / my gallery: http://www.geocities.com/SoHo/Lofts/2605/ - ------------------------------------------------------------ Thanks for using Fractint, The Fractals and Fractint Discussion List Post Message: fractint@xmission.com Get Commands: majordomo@xmission.com "help" Administrator: twegner@phoenix.net Unsubscribe: majordomo@xmission.com "unsubscribe fractint" ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 19 Aug 1997 18:07:59 -0400 (EDT) From: A M Kelley Subject: (fractint) Question - --1920402471-458474435-872028846:#6557 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII The newbie is here with a question. I have had fractals that have a hole in the middle of their spiral that simply refuses to fill in. Attached is an example; the swirl on the left has a filled in hole and the swirl on the right has a blank hole. (Can you stand all this technical jargon?) It doesn't seem to have anything to do with the maxiter. One of my very favorite fractals has one of these holes and I'm tempted to do away with it using Paintshop. If anyone would like to explain these holes, please, no equations.--Alice - --1920402471-458474435-872028846:#6557 Content-Type: APPLICATION/octet-stream; name="question.par" Content-ID: Content-Description: Question_fractal { ; amkelley@freenet.columbus.oh.us reset=1960 type=lambdafn function=ident passes=2 center-mag=-0.345098/0/0.3333333 params=1/0.4 float=y maxiter=2000 invert=1/0.5/0 decomp=256 viewwindows=2/0.75/yes/0/0 colors=iYViYV<25>763552663<29>iloknqjmp<29>773551551<30>WV7WV7VU7<28>662\ 551662<30>xn_<30>773551662<29>m_XoaZn`Yl_XkZW } - --1920402471-458474435-872028846:#6557-- - ------------------------------------------------------------ Thanks for using Fractint, The Fractals and Fractint Discussion List Post Message: fractint@xmission.com Get Commands: majordomo@xmission.com "help" Administrator: twegner@phoenix.net Unsubscribe: majordomo@xmission.com "unsubscribe fractint" ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 19 Aug 1997 19:28:35 -0400 (EDT) From: Jim Muth Subject: Re: (fractint) Question - --=====================_872043905==_ Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" At 06:07 PM 8/19/97 -0400, you wrote: >The newbie is here with a question. I have had fractals that have a hole >in the middle of their spiral that simply refuses to fill in. Attached is >an example; the swirl on the left has a filled in hole and the swirl on >the right has a blank hole. (Can you stand all this technical jargon?) >It doesn't seem to have anything to do with the maxiter. One of my very >favorite fractals has one of these holes and I'm tempted to do away with >it using Paintshop. If anyone would like to explain these holes, >please, no equations.--Alice Alice: The hole in your otherwise fine fractal is caused by a combination of things. First, the bailout is too low -- I set it to 5000. Second, the periodicity should be disabled with this fractal -- I set it to 0. Third, the maxiter need be nowhere as high as you had set it -- I set it to 255. Fourth, the Log Palette should be turned on, which I did. The result is visible in the par file named answer.par, which I have attached. I think this is the effect you were after. Hope I was of help, and good luck with those fractals. Jim Muth jamth@mindspring.com - --=====================_872043905==_ Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Disposition: attachment; filename="ANSWER.PAR" { reset=1960 type=lambdafn function=ident center-mag=-0.34509800000000010/+0.00000000000000000/0.3333333 params=1/0.4 float=y maxiter=255 bailout=5000 logmap=yes invert=1/0.5/0 decomp=256 periodicity=0 colors=000iYV<25>763552663<29>iloknqjmp<29>773551551<30>WV7WV7VU7<26>882\ 772662551662873<29>xn_<31>551<30>m_XoaZn`Yl_XkZW } - --=====================_872043905==_-- - ------------------------------------------------------------ Thanks for using Fractint, The Fractals and Fractint Discussion List Post Message: fractint@xmission.com Get Commands: majordomo@xmission.com "help" Administrator: twegner@phoenix.net Unsubscribe: majordomo@xmission.com "unsubscribe fractint" ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 19 Aug 1997 19:29:04 -0400 From: "Damien M. Jones" Subject: Re: (fractint) Question Alice, This one's easy. Increase your bailout (z options page) to about 1,000,000 or so. It'll go away. Damien M. Jones / temporary sanity designs / http://www.emi.net/~dmj/ dmj@emi.net / my gallery: http://www.geocities.com/SoHo/Lofts/2605/ - ------------------------------------------------------------ Thanks for using Fractint, The Fractals and Fractint Discussion List Post Message: fractint@xmission.com Get Commands: majordomo@xmission.com "help" Administrator: twegner@phoenix.net Unsubscribe: majordomo@xmission.com "unsubscribe fractint" ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 19 Aug 1997 19:34:44 -0400 From: Sylvie Gallet Subject: (fractint) Question Hi Alice, >> The newbie is here with a question. I have had fractals that have a ho= le >> in the middle of their spiral that simply refuses to fill in. Attached= is >> an example; the swirl on the left has a filled in hole and the swirl o= n >> the right has a blank hole. The center of the spiral on the right is also the center of the inversi= on (0.5,0). The inversion transforms each pixel close to (0.5,0) to a very big number and the orbit escapes at the first iteration. >> It doesn't seem to have anything to do with the maxiter. No but the blank hole disappears if you set the bailout value to 10000.= >> please, no equations. It was not necessary ! - Sylvie - ------------------------------------------------------------ Thanks for using Fractint, The Fractals and Fractint Discussion List Post Message: fractint@xmission.com Get Commands: majordomo@xmission.com "help" Administrator: twegner@phoenix.net Unsubscribe: majordomo@xmission.com "unsubscribe fractint" ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 19 Aug 1997 16:52:39 -0700 From: "Jay Hill" Subject: Re: (fractint) Question Fine on terh left side bu-bu-bu--buu-but on the right side the HoleIsStillThere { ; Jay Hill reset=1960 type=lambdafn function=ident center-mag=+0.50184024821583820/-0.00000000000000019/34.24057 params=1/0.4 float=y maxiter=255 bailout=5000 logmap=yes invert=1/0.5/0 decomp=256 periodicity=0 viewwindows=2/0.75/yes/0/0 colors=000iYV<25>763552663<29>iloknqjmp<29>773551551<30>WV7WV7VU7<28>662\ 551662<30>xn_<31>551<30>m_XoaZn`Yl_XkZW } whoever smaller with 4 'corner'. Jay - ------------------------------------------------------------ Thanks for using Fractint, The Fractals and Fractint Discussion List Post Message: fractint@xmission.com Get Commands: majordomo@xmission.com "help" Administrator: twegner@phoenix.net Unsubscribe: majordomo@xmission.com "unsubscribe fractint" ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 20 Aug 1997 00:58:39 -0400 (EDT) From: Donald Archer Subject: Re: (fractint) Question Alice: >The newbie is here with a question. I have had fractals that have a hole >in the middle of their spiral that simply refuses to fill in. Attached is >an example; the swirl on the left has a filled in hole and the swirl on >the right has a blank hole. (Can you stand all this technical jargon?) >It doesn't seem to have anything to do with the maxiter. One of my very >favorite fractals has one of these holes and I'm tempted to do away with >it using Paintshop. If anyone would like to explain these holes, >please, no equations.--Alice >Content-Type: APPLICATION/octet-stream; name="question.par" >Content-ID: >Content-Description: > >Attachment Converted: C:\ARCHDOR\question.par I don't know what to tell you. It's a hole alright, no matter how you look at it. I don't normally use the options that you invoked, but I suspect you've pushed the Fractint code a little beyond the margin for this fractal type. I suggest you ask Tim Wegner, Fractint developer and administrator here. I'd be interested in his response. Nice image, too. Don - ------------------------------------------------------------ Thanks for using Fractint, The Fractals and Fractint Discussion List Post Message: fractint@xmission.com Get Commands: majordomo@xmission.com "help" Administrator: twegner@phoenix.net Unsubscribe: majordomo@xmission.com "unsubscribe fractint" ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 20 Aug 1997 04:19:01 -0400 (EDT) From: Fractalier@aol.com Subject: Re: (fractint) Question In a message dated 97-08-20 04:14:09 EDT, you write: << Alice: >The newbie is here with a question. I have had fractals that have a hole >in the middle of their spiral that simply refuses to fill in. Attached is >an example; the swirl on the left has a filled in hole and the swirl on >the right has a blank hole. (Can you stand all this technical jargon?) >It doesn't seem to have anything to do with the maxiter. One of my very >favorite fractals has one of these holes and I'm tempted to do away with >it using Paintshop. If anyone would like to explain these holes, >please, no equations.--Alice >Content-Type: APPLICATION/octet-stream; name="question.par" >Content-ID: >Content-Description: > >Attachment Converted: C:\ARCHDOR\question.par I don't know what to tell you. It's a hole alright, no matter how you look at it. I don't normally use the options that you invoked, but I suspect you've pushed the Fractint code a little beyond the margin for this fractal type. I suggest you ask Tim Wegner, Fractint developer and administrator here. I'd be interested in his response. Nice image, too. Don >> If you are doing iterative Julia/Mandelbrot set fractals, the black hole in the center is representative of the area of the graph where a greater number of iterations are necessary for the function to exceed the "blowup" parameter...if you increase the number of iterations to 256, 512, 768, 1024 and so on, more of the graph will fill in... ultimately though, the graph will never quite be completely "filled in"... Hope that helps, Jeff - ------------------------------------------------------------ Thanks for using Fractint, The Fractals and Fractint Discussion List Post Message: fractint@xmission.com Get Commands: majordomo@xmission.com "help" Administrator: twegner@phoenix.net Unsubscribe: majordomo@xmission.com "unsubscribe fractint" ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 20 Aug 1997 09:48:17 -0400 From: lelio Subject: (fractint) Hello Hello everyone, I am a new user (6 months) of Fractint. I love it. I just found the mailing list so this is cool too. However when I was cutting and pasting for various .par and .frm files, Fractint didn't like it, I think it put in control characters in the clipboard, I don't know, I have had to re-type them and that's OK, the images have been, for the most part, really cool. Here is my request, could you (being all who post formulas or parameters) post them as e-mail attachments? A few have done this and it makes it so much easier. Like I said I'm still new to the software, but I'm learning, I'll post some .par files soon. :) Thanks, Russel - -------------------------------------------- Time is an illusion, Lunchtime doubly so. - Ford Prefect (by way of Douglas Adams) - ------------------------------------------------------------ Thanks for using Fractint, The Fractals and Fractint Discussion List Post Message: fractint@xmission.com Get Commands: majordomo@xmission.com "help" Administrator: twegner@phoenix.net Unsubscribe: majordomo@xmission.com "unsubscribe fractint" ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 20 Aug 1997 10:18:45 -0400 (EDT) From: A M Kelley Subject: Re: (fractint) Question Thank you to all who answered my question! I'm so glad this was easy. I still have to go look at the pars that were sent to me. Jim, when I turned the log palette on, I hit 2 so it would choose its own setting, and it picked 33, which looked very bad. The log palette always acts that way for me. Sometimes I can improve an image by setting it to 1 or -1, but very rarely does setting it to 2 (the auto setting) do any good. I mean, 33?? I am not totally sure why having a maxiter that's too high is bad. And the periodicity setting....Les St. Clair has tried to explain that to me, and it's like a big brick wall. I never think to try altering that setting because it's so meaningless to me, and I have no way of realizing what kind of fractal might respond to a change in that value. I'll have to try it on all my fractals.--Alice - ------------------------------------------------------------ Thanks for using Fractint, The Fractals and Fractint Discussion List Post Message: fractint@xmission.com Get Commands: majordomo@xmission.com "help" Administrator: twegner@phoenix.net Unsubscribe: majordomo@xmission.com "unsubscribe fractint" ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 20 Aug 1997 10:45:03 -0600 (MDT) From: Subject: Re: (fractint) Question On Wednesday, August 20, 1997 10:18:45 you wrote: >the log palette on, I hit 2 so it would choose its own setting, and it >picked 33, which looked very bad. The log palette always acts that way for >me. Sometimes I can improve an image by setting it to 1 or -1, but very >rarely does setting it to 2 (the auto setting) do any good. I mean, 33?? > I am not totally sure why having a maxiter that's too high is bad. Hi Alice, In the simples case with logpallete = -1 or 1 the colours get spread out across the whole range of iterations possible, from 1 ... maxiter. This means that, if you're looking at a zoomed fractal, some of the 256 available colour bands are in effect outside your screen, not displayed and therefore wasted. In extreme cases this would mean only showing a just few colours when you could have 256.. not necessarily a bad thing but often resulting in a picture with little detail. To counter this you can give logpalette a value (say 33 ) which results in the colour bands being spread across iteration values 33 ... maxiter. What autolog does is do the calculations for all the pixels round the edge of your zoomed view first, find out the lowest value it encountered and then use this as the lower end of the colour spread used by logmap. This only gives good results if the fractal is one which has no 'islands' of lower iterations inside such as the Mset. Though this is the most 'efficient' way of using colours it also results in the colourmap being shifted so you might need to cycle things a bit to get back to the look you had before. Hope this helps, Robin. - ------------------------------------------------------------ Thanks for using Fractint, The Fractals and Fractint Discussion List Post Message: fractint@xmission.com Get Commands: majordomo@xmission.com "help" Administrator: twegner@phoenix.net Unsubscribe: majordomo@xmission.com "unsubscribe fractint" ------------------------------ End of fractint Digest V1 #5 **************************** To subscribe to fractint Digest, send the command: subscribe fractint-digest in the body of a message to "majordomo@xmission.com". 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