From: owner-kraftwerk-digest@lists.xmission.com (kraftwerk-digest) To: kraftwerk-digest@lists.xmission.com Subject: kraftwerk-digest V2 #40 Reply-To: kraftwerk-digest Sender: owner-kraftwerk-digest@lists.xmission.com Errors-To: owner-kraftwerk-digest@lists.xmission.com Precedence: bulk X-No-Archive: yes kraftwerk-digest Tuesday, January 27 1998 Volume 02 : Number 040 ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: Mon, 26 Jan 1998 23:26:31 -0800 From: "ROBOT" Subject: Fw: (kw) Kraftwerk Bashing? > From: Greg Heil > > > (FROESE) "Kraftwerk did a lot of damage to the philosophy of electronic > > music...Kraftwerk's music made it hard for us to do our work. There > > were three or four years in the mid-Eighties when it was difficult for > > people to understand that robotic sounds weren't the only music you > > could make with computers." > > It seems to indicate the commercial sucess and influence of the Kraftwerk > sound. Greg H. I'd say it indicates jealousy. ;] ROBOWINKY Not that there's anything wrong with T.Dream, but, come ON, "damage to the philosophy of electronic music"? Get REAL! Each Artist has his/her own individual concept and philosophy of what his/her Art or Music is and how it should be presented. KW and TD have different concepts of Electronic Music, that's all. It's up to the individual listener's taste as to which concept and presentation is prefered. Oh, shit- My last post DID show up 3 times! Jeez, I'm sorry I cluttered up everyone's Email. I thought my message wasn't received at all. I re-sent it a few hours later and it still didn't show up, so, I sent it a 3rd time. MY mistake, NOT the Server. -(this time.)- *grrr* ROBOT@humboldt1.com http://www.humboldt1.com/~robot/ ROBOT's Silly Sektor of CyberSpace +^+^+^+^+^+^+^+^+^+^+^+^+^+^+^+^+^+^+^+^+^+^+^+^+^+^+^+^+ =K R A F T W E R K=K R A F T W E R K=K R A F T W E R K= +^+^+^+^+^+^+^+^+^+^+^+^+^+^+^+^+^+^+^+^+^+^+^+^+^+^+^+^+ # Need help using (or leaving) this mailing list? # Email majordomo@xmission.com with "info kraftwerk" in the message. # Postings must go to kraftwerk@xmission.com -- replies go to original sender. ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 27 Jan 1998 02:06:01 -0600 From: emkubed Subject: Re: (kw) Loss of samples? Eric Knight wrote: > >From some of the posts to this list, Am I correct that Kraftwerk has to > Re-Sample their OWN music? > > If most of their original tracks were samples, HOW could they be of Poor > quality and have to be re-sampled? I beleive it can't be that hard to take > an analog sample and digitize it. > > Could it be that they want to be different at each live performance? like > replacing some old samples with different ones to change a song slightly > for a different effect/outcome? > > Eric Knight The old samples were stored on tape. In this storage format, recorded data is subject to rapid degradation. So KW resampled and stored the new samples digitally, a format that takes a LONG time to degrade. I remember reading the post(s) that talked about this, which made this fact obvious. # Need help using (or leaving) this mailing list? # Email majordomo@xmission.com with "info kraftwerk" in the message. # Postings must go to kraftwerk@xmission.com -- replies go to original sender. ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 27 Jan 1998 00:14:32 -0800 From: "Elias Granillo, Jr." Subject: (kw) RE: Award For those unaware: in 1992, Kraftwerk received an award for "over a decade of contributions to synthesizer music." I have but two questions: 1) Who was the organization who awarded this? 2) Why have Tangerine Dream never been awarded in kind, and why on earth would Kraftwerk receive this before they? Kraftwerk are one-tenth as prolific, and one-one-thousandth as creative. No flames, please. This is just a legitimate inquiry of Kraftwerk fans, open to critical discussion. Put away your asbestos suits and flamethrowers. Elias Granillo, Jr. upnsm0ke@gte.net "The trouble with life in ivory towers, the seconds stretch until they fit the skins of hours" GEOFF MANN # Need help using (or leaving) this mailing list? # Email majordomo@xmission.com with "info kraftwerk" in the message. # Postings must go to kraftwerk@xmission.com -- replies go to original sender. ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 27 Jan 1998 09:46:32 -0000 From: "Jules Seifert" Subject: Re: (kw) Loss of samples? > >>From some of the posts to this list, Am I correct that Kraftwerk has to >Re-Sample their OWN music? > >If most of their original tracks were samples, HOW could they be of Poor >quality and have to be re-sampled? I beleive it can't be that hard to take >an analog sample and digitize it. > Well, basically because all the original material is on tape, it was clearly stated in the extract, not in sample form at all. > >Could it be that they want to be different at each live performance? like >replacing some old samples with different ones to change a song slightly >for a different effect/outcome? > nope. Jules # Need help using (or leaving) this mailing list? # Email majordomo@xmission.com with "info kraftwerk" in the message. # Postings must go to kraftwerk@xmission.com -- replies go to original sender. ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 27 Jan 1998 09:43:30 -0000 From: "Jules Seifert" Subject: (kw) Bartos / Sumner Good mornin' fellow werkaholics! Out if interest, and from a vid collector's point of view, did anybody catch the BBC documentary about 'Prozak' featuring Bernard Sumner? I remember watching this programme, and also remember our mutual friend Karl Bartos putting in an appearance. Of course, I was totally unprepared for this, and couldn't get the damn tape in the machine in time to catch it. All I remember is Bernard walking into his small studio, and introducing Karl, who was sitting at a keyboard, playing something. Anybody have any more info on this, or even a recording? ciao, - ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- - --------- Jules Seifert #kraftwerk IRC Homepage:- http://wkweb5.cableinet.co.uk/jseifert/kraftwerk/irc.htm ICQ No:- 7421804 # Need help using (or leaving) this mailing list? # Email majordomo@xmission.com with "info kraftwerk" in the message. # Postings must go to kraftwerk@xmission.com -- replies go to original sender. ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 27 Jan 1998 09:52:29 -0000 From: "Jules Seifert" Subject: Re: (kw) Kraftwerk Bashing? > >I would just like to hear some comments as being on the Tangerine >Dream mailing list, some Kraftwerk stuff pops up every now and then. >This is TD's life long influence and composer Edgar Frose: > >> (FROESE) "Kraftwerk did a lot of damage to the philosophy of electronic >> music...Kraftwerk's music made it hard for us to do our work. There were >> three or four years in the mid-Eighties when it was difficult for people >to >> understand that robotic sounds weren't the only music you could make with >> computers." > >It seems to indicate the commercial sucess and influence of the Kraftwerk >sound. > Yes, and it also brings us back to the old 'what is electronic music' debate. Tangerine Dream rightfully have their place in the 'scene' but I think it is not their place to accuse ANY band of damaging the 'philosophy' of electronic music. And moreover, is there a 'philosophy'? If you put most electronic music in front of a music lecturer, they would tell you that the notes are all wrong etc, but that does not make the music invalid. > What would be the reaction if say Kraftwerk members accused TD of ruining the 'philosophy' of electronic music by putting out endless amounts of wishy-washy ambient? Jules # Need help using (or leaving) this mailing list? # Email majordomo@xmission.com with "info kraftwerk" in the message. # Postings must go to kraftwerk@xmission.com -- replies go to original sender. ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 27 Jan 1998 02:17:12 -0800 From: "ROBOT" Subject: Re: (kw) RE: Award > From: Elias Granillo, Jr. > To: kraftwerk@xmission.com > Subject: (kw) RE: Award > Date: Tuesday, January 27, 1998 12:14 AM > > For those unaware: in 1992, Kraftwerk received an award for "over a > decade of contributions to synthesizer music." I have but two questions: > > 1) Who was the organization who awarded this? 'can't remember. It was mentioned in KEYBOARD Magazine at the time. > 2) Why have Tangerine Dream never been awarded in kind, You mean they haven't? Hm-m-m, I wonder why. > and why on earth would Kraftwerk receive this before they? Kraftwerk are > one-tenth as prolific, okay, granted. However, quantity does not neccessarily mean quality. -(I don't mean TD is poor quality. I simply mean that quantity -of ANYthing- in itself is NOT a guarantee of quality.)- > and one-one-thousandth as creative. NOT!!!! As I said in my previous post, it's a matter of personal taste. For my tastes, TD is nice Spacey Hippie ProgRock, but, it doesn't thrill me. - -('Not enough rhythm.)- KW sounds more unique and creative to me- and a lot less "pretentious". If you don't like KW's minimalist mechanical style, fine. No one's forcing you to. It's YOUR tastebuds. To each their own. > No flames, please. This is just a legitimate inquiry of Kraftwerk fans, > open to critical discussion. Put away your asbestos suits and > flamethrowers. WHAT?!! You come in here pissing on KW with insulting remarks such as: [KW is] "one-one-thousandth as creative" [as TD] and tell US "no flames"? I wouldn't go into the TD Mail List and piss on them. Jeez, put away YOUR flamethrower! Nobody's flamed you. -(....Yet.*heehee*.)- ROBOT@humboldt1.com http://www.humboldt1.com/~robot/ ROBOT's Silly Sektor of CyberSpace +^+^+^+^+^+^+^+^+^+^+^+^+^+^+^+^+^+^+^+^+^+^+^+^+^+^+^+^+ =K R A F T W E R K=K R A F T W E R K=K R A F T W E R K= +^+^+^+^+^+^+^+^+^+^+^+^+^+^+^+^+^+^+^+^+^+^+^+^+^+^+^+^+ # Need help using (or leaving) this mailing list? # Email majordomo@xmission.com with "info kraftwerk" in the message. # Postings must go to kraftwerk@xmission.com -- replies go to original sender. ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 27 Jan 1998 10:14:46 -0000 From: "Craig Land" Subject: Re: (kw) Kraftwerk Bashing? >What would be the reaction if say Kraftwerk members accused TD of ruining >the 'philosophy' of electronic music by putting out endless amounts of >wishy-washy ambient? > >Jules May I put my ambient in your wishy-washy?!!!!!!!! Very good Jules, I think the only albums of TD that stick out in my mind are Phaedra and Force Majure, although I haven't heard everything they have released. I remember when that old 80's TV program 'Street Hawk' was on air I thought I would buy the TD album 'Le Parc' as they had produced the theme music for this show. What a pile of trash, but that's only my opinion! I took the album back to the store and got a refund. Craig. # Need help using (or leaving) this mailing list? # Email majordomo@xmission.com with "info kraftwerk" in the message. # Postings must go to kraftwerk@xmission.com -- replies go to original sender. ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 27 Jan 1998 11:51:27 +0000 From: "GUNTHER PoeCKER STUDENT" Subject: (kw) New Karlsruhe Bootleg Hi to all on the list, A new bootleg CD of the Karlsruhe concert is now available in germany (on record fairs, no firm source). Interesting is the fact that it is a different recording to 'ZKM', and the sound quality is quite a bit better: more bass, only very little audience interference. It is clearly not a 'soundboard recording' as the dealer claimed... but I'm 99% sure it has been recorded from the stairs to the VIP area on first floor. Sadly, it misses the 'blooping' intro and the run-out of 'Music non stop', so the completist need both CD's. For anyone who wants the best recording, this is preferable to 'ZKM'. Details: 'Die Rueckkehr der Mensch-Maschine - The Return of the Man Machine', Maschinen Music 1/2000 A/B, dark blue cover with silver titles, photo while playing 'Music non stop'. Bye, Gunther # Need help using (or leaving) this mailing list? # Email majordomo@xmission.com with "info kraftwerk" in the message. # Postings must go to kraftwerk@xmission.com -- replies go to original sender. ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 27 Jan 1998 05:25:22 -0600 (CST) From: cyberspace buddha Subject: (kw) Re: kraftwerk-digest V2 #39 Sat, 24 Jan 1998, jbv wrote: > My problem is that I'm pretty lazy/busy at the moment and can't afford > to send almost 4 Mb to 12 or 15 people. And I don't have any personal > page where to put them on line (which is quite stupid for I have 5 Mb > available somewhere). I have effectively unlimited web-space, on more than one server, and am more than willing to host these images. However, all of these servers are in Austin, Tx, and in very close net-proximity. So, if most of 'us' are relatively remote, this might be intollerably slow for some/most. Let me know if you want to take advantage of me. cheers, cb Cyberspace Buddha /(0\ What's on, your mind? mailto:cb@silverchat.com \1)/ http://silverchat.com/~cb Not your fathers buddha. # Need help using (or leaving) this mailing list? # Email majordomo@xmission.com with "info kraftwerk" in the message. # Postings must go to kraftwerk@xmission.com -- replies go to original sender. ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 27 Jan 1998 12:29:21 +0000 From: Paulo Mouat Subject: Re: (kw) Kraftwerk Bashing? Greg Heil wrote: > > (FROESE) "Kraftwerk did a lot of damage to the philosophy of > > electronic music...Kraftwerk's music made it hard for us to do our > > work. There were three or four years in the mid-Eighties when it was > > difficult for people to understand that robotic sounds weren't the > > only music you could make with computers." > > It seems to indicate the commercial sucess and influence of the > Kraftwerk sound. IMHO, it only means that in some ways Kraftwerk conditioned audiences not familiar with electronic instruments and music, making them believe that the only thing that could come out of synthesizers was "mechanical" and "robotic" music, thus imprinting erroneous preconceptions towards all music made with such instruments in the people not captivated by the concept. I don't think the statement has negative overtones at all, despite having its share of exactness and truth. - -- __|__ ___\_/___ ___ Paulo Mouat, |___| mouat@mail.telepac.pt |___| http://www.geocities.com/Vienna/8804 # Need help using (or leaving) this mailing list? # Email majordomo@xmission.com with "info kraftwerk" in the message. # Postings must go to kraftwerk@xmission.com -- replies go to original sender. ------------------------------ Date: 27 Jan 98 09:45:05 -0500 From: Chris Gross Subject: (kw) re: Award > No flames, please. This is just a legitimate inquiry of Kraftwerk fans, > open to critical discussion. Put away your asbestos suits and > flamethrowers. A bit like punching someone in the nose and saying, "Now don't start getting violent..." ;-) ____________ Chris Gross (cgross@erols.com, cgross@harris-pub.com, golem14@hotmail.com) # Need help using (or leaving) this mailing list? # Email majordomo@xmission.com with "info kraftwerk" in the message. # Postings must go to kraftwerk@xmission.com -- replies go to original sender. ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 27 Jan 1998 12:28:09 +0100 From: Anders Wilhelm Subject: (kw) Samples from Telephone Call/Housephone? Has anyone on the list sampled stuff out of Telephone Calle/ Housephone? Please mail me in that case. I need specially the "The number you have reached has been disconnected" and "The number you call is wrong, please call information." Thanks in advance /anders # Need help using (or leaving) this mailing list? # Email majordomo@xmission.com with "info kraftwerk" in the message. # Postings must go to kraftwerk@xmission.com -- replies go to original sender. ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 27 Jan 1998 18:07:32 +0100 From: RoBot Subject: Re: (kw) Samples from Telephone Call/Housephone? At 12:28 1998-01-27 +0100, Anders Wilhelm wrote: > >Has anyone on the list sampled stuff out of Telephone Calle/ >Housephone? Please mail me in that case. I need specially >the "The number you have reached has been disconnected" >and "The number you call is wrong, please call information." > >Thanks in advance >/anders Jag kan rippa fr=E5n EC om du vill till 44.1khz stereo wavar.. //RoBoten # Need help using (or leaving) this mailing list? # Email majordomo@xmission.com with "info kraftwerk" in the message. # Postings must go to kraftwerk@xmission.com -- replies go to original sender. ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 27 Jan 1998 18:11:42 +0100 From: RoBoten Subject: Re: (kw) Samples from Telephone Call/Housephone? Sorry all for the previous reply. It was meant only to Anders. The reply was also using the wrong Name. Sorry again!! Those fingers are too fast sometimes! //RoBoten # Need help using (or leaving) this mailing list? # Email majordomo@xmission.com with "info kraftwerk" in the message. # Postings must go to kraftwerk@xmission.com -- replies go to original sender. ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 27 Jan 1998 21:17:58 +0100 From: jbv Subject: Re: (kw) Kraftwerk Bashing? Paulo Mouat wrote: > > IMHO, it only means that in some ways Kraftwerk conditioned audiences > not familiar with electronic instruments and music, making them believe > that the only thing that could come out of synthesizers was "mechanical" > and "robotic" music, thus imprinting erroneous preconceptions towards > all music made with such instruments in the people not captivated by > the concept. > > I don't think the statement has negative overtones at all, despite > having its share of exactness and truth. > -- Good point, Paulo (as always). May I had a few things : 1- in the early 70s, the situation was quite the opposite : TD used to attract lots of people to their gigs (much more than KW anyway) and I remember that lots of people (at least in my neiborghood) used to listen to Phaedra, Ricochet and Aqua, and had never heard of KW 1 or 2 or 3. 2- in the mid-80s, people were not anymore interested in sitting and tripping for hours, just listening to spacey beat-less drones. The way of life was different, thus leading to more interest in faster/ catchy rythms and poppy melodies. 3- according to the above, I really doubt that "electronic music" per se ever really mattered to the audience... 4- and if it did anyway for a certain part of the audience (geeks, certainly), it is true that right after the introduction of MIDI and the first sequencers on personal computers, it was 10 times easier to run short repetitive MIDI loops driving simple synth patches, than building complex evolution of sophisticated textures (which doesn't imply that IMO TD ever did anything sophisticated). Therefore, the aboundance of cheap gear lead to a massive wave of home-made repetitive / "robotic" synth productions (indeed, tons of indie singles and cassettes in the mid-80s) that overflood the market, and made those guys with their walls covered with huge expensive modulars look like pathetic dinosaurs... jbv # Need help using (or leaving) this mailing list? # Email majordomo@xmission.com with "info kraftwerk" in the message. # Postings must go to kraftwerk@xmission.com -- replies go to original sender. ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 27 Jan 1998 21:57:58 -0800 From: **************** Subject: RE: (kw) RE: Award Granillo wrote: >For those unaware: in 1992, Kraftwerk received an award for "over a = decade of contributions to synthesizer music." I have but two questions: 1) Who was the organization who awarded this? 2) Why have Tangerine Dream never been awarded in kind, and why on earth would Kraftwerk receive this before they? Kraftwerk are one-tenth as prolific, and one-one-thousandth as creative. < I'm fed up with TD been compared to Kraftwerk just because they're both = German and produce electronic music. TD have been prolific, however, = their output has been shit. Contrast this with Kraftwerk, who've been = very selective in what they've released. It is Kraftwerk who have = developed electronic music in the most creative way possible. TD have = repackaged the same rubbish countless times. >No flames, please. This is just a legitimate inquiry of Kraftwerk fans, open to critical discussion. Put away your asbestos suits and flamethrowers.< If you've joined this list to shovel shit don't expect many friends. I = wouldn't turn up on the TD list and rubbish their pathetic albums. # Need help using (or leaving) this mailing list? # Email majordomo@xmission.com with "info kraftwerk" in the message. # Postings must go to kraftwerk@xmission.com -- replies go to original sender. ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 26 Jan 1998 20:46:19 +0100 (NFT) From: Klaus Zaepke Subject: Re: (kw) More Superior promo items > The Esprit Mailorder catalogue (www.eil.com) lists some more > Superior promo items in addition to the promo 12" and the promo > 2-track enhanced CD, which were already mentioned here a while back: > > SUPERIOR Album Sampler (Virgin UK 4-trk promo cassette + title inlay) > SUPERIOR Coma (Withdrawn UK 4-trk promo CD, incls Komatrix > Mix by Karl Bartos of Kraftwerk + Baader Meinhof Mix, etc, p/s > VSCDJ1646) Still more Superior promo material (quoted from www.eil.com): SUPERIOR Germ Free (UK 12-trk advance promo cassette + title inlay) UK 4.99 / $ 8.00 SUPERIOR Coma (Unreleased UK 4-trk enhanced CD inc Baader Meinhof Mix, New Pain New Gain Mix & Fibreflex Mix, digipak p/s VSCDG1646) UK 4.99 / $ 8.00 Details for the above mentioned 4-track promo cassette album sampler are: 1. Stampede 2. Coma 3. Faster Than You 4. Polaroid Millenium Source: CD-R Copied 20.06.97 No further credits. The version of "Coma" is the standard version, not the version remixed by Karl Bartos. Klaus Zaepke # Need help using (or leaving) this mailing list? # Email majordomo@xmission.com with "info kraftwerk" in the message. # Postings must go to kraftwerk@xmission.com -- replies go to original sender. # Need help using (or leaving) this mailing list? # Email majordomo@xmission.com with "info kraftwerk" in the message. # Postings must go to kraftwerk@xmission.com -- replies go to original sender. ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 26 Jan 1998 20:42:38 +0100 (NFT) From: Klaus Zaepke Subject: (kw) Dinger vs. EastWest (part 2) The main hearing in the lawsuit Klaus Dinger vs. EastWest Records concerning the legitimacy of the three La Duesseldorf CD reissues (see http://http://corona.tp1.ruhr-uni-bochum.de/people/gawlista/mucke/eastwest.html) is now scheduled for February, according to the jpc Courier 2/1998. Klaus Zaepke # Need help using (or leaving) this mailing list? # Email majordomo@xmission.com with "info kraftwerk" in the message. # Postings must go to kraftwerk@xmission.com -- replies go to original sender. # Need help using (or leaving) this mailing list? # Email majordomo@xmission.com with "info kraftwerk" in the message. # Postings must go to kraftwerk@xmission.com -- replies go to original sender. ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 26 Jan 1998 20:53:55 +0100 (NFT) From: Klaus Zaepke Subject: Re: (kw) Pics of KW > From: jbv > > There's also a few Mb of various ads, articles and reviews from the > same period and mentioning KW, but it has been sent to Klaus already. > So if that stuff doesn't get online, blame him... I've added most of these articles to my "Kraftwerk Online Library" (http://home.t-online.de/home/Zaepke/kraftwer.htm). Due to limited disk space, I've radically reduced the size (and quality!) of the original scans, but most of the writing should be still decipherable. > Last but not least : there's still that 2-pages interview given by > Ralf to a german fanzine in 91, which looks interesting but which I > never finished to translate into english. I've also added low-quality scans from this article ("Es wird immer weitergehen...", Frontpage 7-8/1991) to my "Online Library". The URL for this article is: http://home.t-online.de/home/Zaepke/fp.htm. Klaus Zaepke # Need help using (or leaving) this mailing list? # Email majordomo@xmission.com with "info kraftwerk" in the message. # Postings must go to kraftwerk@xmission.com -- replies go to original sender. # Need help using (or leaving) this mailing list? # Email majordomo@xmission.com with "info kraftwerk" in the message. # Postings must go to kraftwerk@xmission.com -- replies go to original sender. ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 26 Jan 1998 20:42:38 +0100 (NFT) From: Klaus Zaepke Subject: (kw) Dinger vs. EastWest (part 2) The main hearing in the lawsuit Klaus Dinger vs. EastWest Records concerning the legitimacy of the three La Duesseldorf CD reissues (see http://http://corona.tp1.ruhr-uni-bochum.de/people/gawlista/mucke/eastwest.html) is now scheduled for February, according to the jpc Courier 2/1998. Klaus Zaepke # Need help using (or leaving) this mailing list? # Email majordomo@xmission.com with "info kraftwerk" in the message. # Postings must go to kraftwerk@xmission.com -- replies go to original sender. # Need help using (or leaving) this mailing list? # Email majordomo@xmission.com with "info kraftwerk" in the message. # Postings must go to kraftwerk@xmission.com -- replies go to original sender. ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 27 Jan 1998 19:20:28 -0600 From: angela Subject: Re: (kw) Kraftwerk Bashing? Conditioned? I think this is a mild insult to Kraftwerk's audience. I am a huge > admirer of > Kraftwerk, but I certainly do not limit myself to thinking that all of electronic > music should > be like that, or any types of music for that matter. As far as electronic music > goes, I personally can go from Kraftwerk to Eno to Japan to Jean-Jacques > Perrey(sorry if mispelled) to Human League to whatever, I try to expand my musical > and artistic horizons as much as I can. Sorry if I came off negative. > Yours > truly, Heather D. > > Paulo Mouat wrote: > > > Greg Heil wrote: > > > >IMHO, it only means that in some ways Kraftwerk conditioned audiences > > not familiar with electronic instruments and music, making them believe > > that the only thing that could come out of synthesizers was "mechanical" > > and "robotic" music, thus imprinting erroneous preconceptions towards > > all music made with such instruments in the people not captivated by > > the concept. > > > > I don't think the statement has negative overtones at all, despite > > having its share of exactness and truth. > > -- > > __|__ > > ___\_/___ > > ___ Paulo Mouat, > > |Need help using (or leaving) this mailing list? > > # Email majordomo@xmission.com with "info kraftwerk" in the message. > > # Postings must go to kraftwerk@xmission.com -- replies go to original sender. > > > > # Need help using (or leaving) this mailing list? # Email majordomo@xmission.com with "info kraftwerk" in the message. # Postings must go to kraftwerk@xmission.com -- replies go to original sender. ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 27 Jan 1998 19:23:55 -0600 From: angela Subject: Message Bounce: Re: (kw) Kraftwerk Bashing? Here,Here. I agree with you totally. It is not Kraftwerk's fault if a certain > audience limits their thinking on how music ought to be. If anything, Froese > should be bitter against the audience that thinks this, not Kraftwerk. For > example, one of my favorite film-makers is John Waters, but does that mean I think > every independent, low budget film should have > transvestites and serial mom's? Of course not! Oh well. Good day to all. > > Yours truly Heather D. > > Jules Seifert wrote: > > > > > This is TD's life long influence and composer Edgar Frose: > > > > > >> (FROESE) "Kraftwerk did a lot of damage to the philosophy of electronic > > >> music...Kraftwerk's music made it hard for us to do our work. There were > > >> three or four years in the mid-Eighties when it was difficult for people > > >to > > >> understand that robotic sounds weren't the only music you could make with > > >> computers." > > > > > >It seems to indicate the commercial sucess and influence of the Kraftwerk > > >sound. > > > > > Yes, and it also brings us back to the old 'what is electronic music' > > debate. Tangerine Dream rightfully have their place in the 'scene' but I > > think it is not their place to accuse ANY band of damaging the 'philosophy' > > of electronic music. Jules > > > > # Need help using (or leaving) this mailing list? > > # Email majordomo@xmission.com with "info kraftwerk" in the message. > > # Postings must go to kraftwerk@xmission.com -- replies go to original sender. > > > > # Need help using (or leaving) this mailing list? # Email majordomo@xmission.com with "info kraftwerk" in the message. # Postings must go to kraftwerk@xmission.com -- replies go to original sender. ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 27 Jan 1998 00:17:33 +0100 From: jbv Subject: Re: (kw) Pics of KW Klaus Zaepke wrote: > > I've also added low-quality scans from this article ("Es wird immer > weitergehen...", Frontpage 7-8/1991) to my "Online Library". > The URL for this article is: > http://home.t-online.de/home/Zaepke/fp.htm. > > Klaus Zaepke > Great. So, is there anyone out there who will take a couple of hours to translate that thing and post it to the list ? I can understand about 60% of it, but would really like to get the whole thing. And I'm sure I'm not the only one. BTW, if readability of scans is a problem, I have high quality scans of that paper that I can email. jbv # Need help using (or leaving) this mailing list? # Email majordomo@xmission.com with "info kraftwerk" in the message. # Postings must go to kraftwerk@xmission.com -- replies go to original sender. # Need help using (or leaving) this mailing list? # Email majordomo@xmission.com with "info kraftwerk" in the message. # Postings must go to kraftwerk@xmission.com -- replies go to original sender. ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 27 Jan 1998 21:36:16 -0500 (EST) From: "John B. Morgan" Subject: Re: (kw) Kraftwerk Bashing? On Mon, 26 Jan 1998, Greg Heil wrote: > > (FROESE) "Kraftwerk did a lot of damage to the philosophy of electronic > > music...Kraftwerk's music made it hard for us to do our work. There were > > three or four years in the mid-Eighties when it was difficult for people > to > > understand that robotic sounds weren't the only music you could make with > > computers." This strikes me as being about as absurd as a classical-era composer complaining of the inordinate amount of attention Mozart gets, as opposed to his contemporaries. I can see it now...Salieri: "Mozart did a lot of damage to the philosophy of music..." This strikes me as the bitterness of the second-rate. (And I LIKE some of TD's stuff.) John Morgan "'One can't always be high.' Oh no? One The University of Michigan only has to properly orient oneself." jbmorgan@umich.edu --Walter Benjamin http://www-personal.umich.edu/~jbmorgan/ including The Colin Wilson Page # Need help using (or leaving) this mailing list? # Email majordomo@xmission.com with "info kraftwerk" in the message. # Postings must go to kraftwerk@xmission.com -- replies go to original sender. ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 27 Jan 1998 21:55:35 -0500 (EST) From: cdaraghy@bestweb.net (Charlie Daraghy) Subject: (kw) re: ralf interview On 25, January, Ralf Hutter said: Q : A few legends say that the KK studio is full of unreleased tapes... R : Not full, but there are a few tapes... We never recorded a lot, things are rather inside our heads. We have very few archives. = Everything we use for our work is stored as computer data, but there are = very few finished products. When we did EC (...) we didn't act like a singer who checks his cassettes and chooses what he'll put on the album. But we have a lot of computer programs, and we launch them when necessary. (...) Oh, and I plan to post the files on my America Online account website so that dozens of computer geeks (i.e. "fans") can download them. I really hope someone will make a recordable CD-R and bootleg the audio files too, for their own financial gain. This would really please me. Sehr gut. - -Ralf - -.-.-.-.-.-.-.-.-. ASCII upload complete. p&c Ping Pong Studios 1998 - -.-.-.-.-.-.-.-.-. # Need help using (or leaving) this mailing list? # Email majordomo@xmission.com with "info kraftwerk" in the message. # Postings must go to kraftwerk@xmission.com -- replies go to original sender. ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 25 Jan 1998 18:30:25 -0800 From: "ROBOT" Subject: (kw) Fw: SynthPop NetWork/Release E-Mag > From: Kotta > To: Kraftwerk Mailing List > Subject: (kw) Newsgroup > Date: Saturday, January 24, 1998 4:31 PM > > hiya, > what about the alt.music.kraftwerk newsgroup, > ever used? Funny thing- I get all the other "alt" news groups, but, I can't find alt.music.kraftwerk on my server. -(Super News? Whatever Humboldt Internet uses.)- There is another KW News Group: uwp.maillist.kraftwerk that is seldom-used, but, it IS on my server. Kotta also asked me if there is a Mobile Homes WebSite, so we can keep tabs on Karl if he IS collaborating with them. Well, I couldn't find any MH WebSites, but, the SynthPop NetWork covers a LOT of different bands. North-American Division: http://nesc.me.utexas.edu/~sball/synthpop.html European Division: http://www.euronet.nl/users/mh/synthpop.html Darn, no MH or Panasonic?? -(I've heard about these guys. Finland, eh? KooL! I gotta hear their tunes!)- So, I poked around some more and found an E-mag called Release On-Line. Click on NEWS, then click on "click here for previous news entries", then click Jan 19th and scroll about halfway down.... here's a brief blurb about Mobile Homes: >> Now The Mobile Homes seems to be back with more than rumours and talk. Preliminary facts tells that there will be a new single in February called "You Bring the Sunshine" and that the new album will be out in March. We get back with the definite facts as soon as they exist. << I read somewhere else that Karl is busy with Electronic. -(I thought they broke up, and so did Elektric Music. Hm-m-m....)- So, I guess he wont be collaborating on this new MH album after all. -????- Dang, where DID I read that? Rats, I lost it. :[ Release On-Line also mentions a re-release of Suicide's first album from 1977, other "Previous News" sections mention S.P.O.C.K, and TOO many other KooL Artists to list. Interesting stuff. ....Whoa! Looky here: KRAFTWERK ALERT!! <*WhooOOP-WhooOOP*> !! - -(Dec 10th section, halfway down)- >> Despite all the usual rumours Kraftwerk have not scheduled any releases for the nearest future. Something will be released, but we don't know when or what yet. You just never know with these guys, do you? But their record plans feels more promising now, since the have played live three times this year. The last two apperances was recently in Karlsruhe (Germany) and Linz (Austria). Kraftwerk performed three new, but (still?) instrumental tracks. << *sigh* Sometime late this year, maybe? Altogether now: "DUH-h, Ralf!". Okay- back to the INFOBAHN. Let's see what other goodies I can find.... ROBOT@humboldt1.com http://www.humboldt1.com/~robot/ ROBOT's Silly Sektor of CyberSpace +^+^+^+^+^+^+^+^+^+^+^+^+^+^+^+^+^+^+^+^+^+^+^+^+^+^+^+^+ =K R A F T W E R K=K R A F T W E R K=K R A F T W E R K= +^+^+^+^+^+^+^+^+^+^+^+^+^+^+^+^+^+^+^+^+^+^+^+^+^+^+^+^+ Now The Mobile Homes seems to be back with more than rumours and talk. Preliminary facts tells that there will be a new single in February called "You Bring the Sunshine" and that the new album will be out in March. We get back with the definite facts as soon as they exist. # Need help using (or leaving) this mailing list? # Email majordomo@xmission.com with "info kraftwerk" in the message. # Postings must go to kraftwerk@xmission.com -- replies go to original sender. # Need help using (or leaving) this mailing list? # Email majordomo@xmission.com with "info kraftwerk" in the message. # Postings must go to kraftwerk@xmission.com -- replies go to original sender. ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 26 Jan 1998 22:08:50 -0700 From: "Greg Heil" Subject: (kw) Kraftwerk Bashing? I would just like to hear some comments as being on the Tangerine Dream mailing list, some Kraftwerk stuff pops up every now and then. This is TD's life long influence and composer Edgar Frose: > (FROESE) "Kraftwerk did a lot of damage to the philosophy of electronic > music...Kraftwerk's music made it hard for us to do our work. There were > three or four years in the mid-Eighties when it was difficult for people to > understand that robotic sounds weren't the only music you could make with > computers." It seems to indicate the commercial sucess and influence of the Kraftwerk sound. Greg H. # Need help using (or leaving) this mailing list? # Email majordomo@xmission.com with "info kraftwerk" in the message. # Postings must go to kraftwerk@xmission.com -- replies go to original sender. # Need help using (or leaving) this mailing list? # Email majordomo@xmission.com with "info kraftwerk" in the message. # Postings must go to kraftwerk@xmission.com -- replies go to original sender. ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 18 Jan 1998 12:32:42 +0000 From: "Klaus Zaepke" Subject: (kw) Mixmag The January issue of Mixmag features a brief review of Kraftwerk's 1997 Tribal Gathering appearance. Small live photo ("Homecomputer"). Klaus Zaepke # Need help using (or leaving) this mailing list? # Email majordomo@xmission.com with "info kraftwerk" in the message. # Postings must go to kraftwerk@xmission.com -- replies go to original sender. # Need help using (or leaving) this mailing list? # Email majordomo@xmission.com with "info kraftwerk" in the message. # Postings must go to kraftwerk@xmission.com -- replies go to original sender. # Need help using (or leaving) this mailing list? # Email majordomo@xmission.com with "info kraftwerk" in the message. # Postings must go to kraftwerk@xmission.com -- replies go to original sender. ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 27 Jan 1998 23:06:33 -0700 (MST) From: Ra Subject: Re: (kw) RE: Award On Tue, 27 Jan 1998, ROBOT wrote: > > From: Elias Granillo, Jr. > > and one-one-thousandth as creative. > NOT!!!! As I said in my previous post, it's a matter of personal taste. For > my tastes, TD is nice Spacey Hippie ProgRock, but, it doesn't thrill me. > -('Not enough rhythm.)- KW sounds more unique and creative to me- and a lot > less "pretentious". If you don't like KW's minimalist mechanical style, > fine. No one's forcing you to. It's YOUR tastebuds. To each their own. I'm not in any way intending to lend credence to Elias's blasphemous comments by saying this... I will say that people who, like me, aren't turned on by Tangerine Dream should at least give the Dream Mixes disc a try. It's almost listenable in some places. It has something resembling a rhythm, even! /* Soleil "Ra" Lapierre www.cuug.ab.ca/~lapierrs * * "The human race believes in not taking its problems seriously * enough to solve them." - Celia Green */ # Need help using (or leaving) this mailing list? # Email majordomo@xmission.com with "info kraftwerk" in the message. # Postings must go to kraftwerk@xmission.com -- replies go to original sender. ------------------------------ End of kraftwerk-digest V2 #40 ******************************